New Portobello High School- Where and how?

[Lawrence Marshall]

[Cynthia]

[Gemini]

[quote="Lawrence Marshall"]I welcome this new thread and the discussion this will allow regarding provision of a new Portobello High School.
A new golf course would have been provided quite near by - the main reason Maureen and I were asked to keep the golf course option secret was the need to negotiate the acquisiton of the land required for a new 18-hole course.
This option was self-financing, including as it did building on the current school site, moving the High School to the golf course and providing playing fields alongside (around one third of the park), building houses on another third and keeping one third as a park. No other option is self-financing - and that's why I can't see any prospect of a new school in the near future if that new school is dependent on Council or Scottish Executive monies. The Council has not a penny to make this happen - we barely have enough money to do repairs to the existing building year on year.
When contemplating the failure of my attempt to see if the High School could be re-located to the Power League site (a High School on the High Street attracted me) I did mention to officials the possibility of the Freightliner site. It would be of sufficient size to accommmodate both a new school and its playing fields. However, and I think rightly so, this site was ruled out since it is rather isolated, sandwiched as it is between the main East Coast rail line and the Portobello bypass. It wouldn't have been as expensive as, say, the site proposed for the superstore, however, as, although also zoned for industrial use, you couldn't ever think that housing would be permitted there.
The suggestion of perhaps being able to acquire the Laidlaw's site and at least parts of the Baileyfield Industrial Estate is intriguing. It's a central site but not obtrusive. I don't know if it's an option but it's worth keeping in mind should Laidlaw's show any wish to re-locate.
The current PPP programme across the city has certainly raised people's expectations - but, if you're not in it, projects as expensive as a new Portobello High School really are very difficult to see a way forward on.



If I recall correctly - in Duddingston House Properties 'Master Plan' for
Portobello, Brammell Laidlaw/Council 'tip' etc, were given over to housing.

In the information provided by (DHP) on view at the Library, before the PI,
There was a document from Standard Life stating that they would up for negotiating the sale of the Council Site on the Causeway.

If DHP's plan showed Laidlaw's site given over to housing, then some sort of talks must have taken place between the two, or could this juust be pure speculation? (Enter Porty!)

Both sites in question, are fairly large, and IMO could accomodate a new Porty High School quite comfortably.

[Bob Jefferson]

[Cynthia]

[Gemini]

[Porty]

[Cynthia]

[karen]

[Porty]

[Porty]

[Cynthia]

[Cynthia]

[Porty]

[Cynthia]

[Porty]

[Bob Jefferson]

One of the reasons the Council would have for keeping quiet about the possibility of buying land to provide an alternative golf course would be to avoid a situation whereby an artificially high value for the site was created through public knowledge that it represented a key element of a much bigger picture.

I had been aware of this possibility for some time but, until now, respected the reasons for confidentiality. Following Lawrence's recent posting however I felt that, with the Golf Course proposal in jeapordy, it was important that people knew that there were at least plans to replace the facility. If Karen is correct, let's hope Lord Burton has his philanthropist's hat on and isn't out to make a fast buck.

It's not the first time this situation has arisen and it won't be the last. Councillors are often caught between a rock and a hard place. We all want to be kept informed, we demand transparency, but we must also appreciate that there are occasions when deals have to be done behind closed doors for very good reasons.

[Cynthia]

[Gemini]

[Porty]

[Cynthia]

[Porty]

Thanks Carla.

Lawrence has presented us with a scheme that has funding, requires no PPP/PFi involvement. Does involve the sale of land to developers. Does involve the sacrifice of an amenity although an alternative is being sought. Does include playing fields and does include retention of parkland. Giving us a reasonable chance of having a new high school before the end of the decade.

To summarise your views and at the risk of mis-representation, please correct me if I am wrong.

You do not accept your elected representatives when they publicly state that the coucil have no money. You argue that they are just spending it in the wrong budgets.

When an elected representative tells us that he has explored many avenues and he can see no other way to deliver a new school in the forseeable futures, you don't accept it.

You do not see it as the public role to come up with a workable solution. It is the job of our elected representatives.

You do not recognise or accept that there is a "pecking order" ie there are many City schools deemed more needy than PHS .

Scottish Parly and the UK government should be picking up all or a substantial part of the tab. As the Government came to power on a education manifesto.

Deals with private developers and schemes such as PPP/PFI are wholly unacceptable.

Building a new school on open space is unacceptable.

There is no room for compromise on any of the above.


And in terms of alternative scenarios:

You have suggested some different ways of funding but can offer no gut feel on if and when funds may become available? You cannot say if by deploying your suggested funding a strategy a new school will be available by say 2025.

A project of this size should be planned.

You prefer the Laidlaw option, although you have suggested no mechanism for making it happen.

You view that a new school is vital but there is no rush.

You would prefer or insist that the council come to public meetings with all of the finances in place.

Is that a fair representation? ( I had to squeeze in 1 question)

[Gemini]

[Porty]

[Gemini]

[Porty]

[Gemini]

[Porty]

[Cynthia]

[Porty]

[Jbrock]

[Porty]

Some research on the "pecking order" for COEC replacement and refurbishment programme. PPP1 was signed in November 2001 and from what I can gather it is a bit behind, based on St Peters being opened in September 2005 and Firhill is not yet complete/

I believe PPP2 is not signed as yet and perhaps Lawrence can tell us if and when this is anticipated? I am aware that Holyrood which is on PP2 is delayed, indefineltly

PORTOBELLO is not on PP2 so on the basis that PP1 took 4 years our place on the pecking order could be 8 to 10 years away if we are on PPP3?.

Appendix 8: Public Private Partnership

The contract for Edinburgh's first PPP project was signed in November 2001. This project will result in ten new primary schools, five new or refurbished secondary schools, two new special schools, a close support and secure unit and a new community education centre. In December 2004, the ITN (Invitation to Negotiate) for Edinburgh's second PPP project was sent out to bidders and the preferred bidder will be named by Summer 2005.

PPP1
Contract:
Capital value of works - £91 million
Unitary payment for buildings and services - £12 million per annum
The contract expires after 32 years – 2 years construction and 30 years operation.

Completed projects:
Pirniehall and St David's RC Primary Schools (joint campus) August 2002
Craigroyston Primary School November 2002
Broomhouse and St Joseph's RC Primary Schools (joint campus) November 2002
Rowanfield School November 2002
Craigour Park Primary School December 2002
Castleview Primary School April 2003
Goodtrees Community Centre August 2003
Forthview Primary School August 2003
Drummond Community High School August 2003
The Royal High School August 2003
Gracemount High School August 2003
Craigmount High School August 2003
Howdenhall Secure and Closure Support Unit October 2003

Construction Timetable for remaining schools

Oxgangs Primary School Spring 2005
St Peter's RC Primary School Spring 2005
Firrhill High School Summer 2005
Graysmill/Willowpark School Summer 2005

PPP2- As yet unsigned

Projects
Bonaly Primary School
Broughton High School
Craigroyston Community High School
Forrester High School
Holy Rood RC High School
Juniper Green Primary School
St Augustine's RC High School
Tynecastle High School

[Jbrock]

[Porty]

[Jbrock]