New Portobello High School- Where and how?

[Porty]

[Epykat]

[Porty]

[Epykat]

[Bob Jefferson]

[Bob Jefferson]

From today's EN Letters Page (3rd letter down):

[Bob Jefferson]

From today's EN Letters Page (last letter):

[Bob Jefferson]

From today's EN - this may have some relevance. Seanie?

[seanie]

If it goes through as outlined then maybe but it would depend on exactly how the policy's worded and possibly the balance of provision of any proposals. I don't see why a proposal couldn't recreate the existing amenity, enhance and extend it, as well as increasing publicly accessible open space. But the final formulation of policy would be crucial.

However I'm sceptical that any such change would go through without some kind of public interest get out clause.

I can see the reasoning behind the proposals. There are various framework policies laid down by the Scottish Executive to protect green space; NPPG 11, PAN 65, SportScotland as a statutory consultee etc. However despite that there has been ongoing loss of open space. There's been lots of development leading to the loss of playing fields.

And many of those developments have been approved by the Scottish Executive.

If a controversial proposal gets appealed, or a Local Authority proposal is objected to, it goes up to the Executive. And despite their own policies on open space the Scottish Executive has on numerous occassions approved development on open space. That's because the planning system is intended to balance competing interests and sometimes certain policies may be judged to outweigh others.

To that extent I can see the Scottish Executive tightening policy on open/recreational space but I'd still expect them to leave themselves some flexibility and discretion.

[Dave Connelly]

I heard today that they had to turn away golfers at Porty the other day, as every Tee off was fully booked and there were people waiting.
Can anyone verify that?

[gilo]

[Dave Connelly]

No, they would have to wait about 5 years for any new course to be up and running. There are other 18 hole courses around and they choose to come to Porty. There is no guarantee that if the council build a new course that it will have more than 9 holes, Lawrence suggested that 6 was the new fad.

[seanie]

[Dave Connelly]

[Bob Jefferson]

[gilo]

[Bob Jefferson]

[seanie]

[Porty]

[Dave Connelly]

[Alison Connelly]

..

[Rex_Mundi]

[Porty]

[bellybabe]

[Porty]

[Dave Connelly]

[Alison Connelly]

[seanie]

[seanie]

The following is the standard RIBA procedure;

PROJECT STAGES

A: Appraisal Identification of client's requirements and possible constraints on development. Preparation of studies to enable the client to decide whether to proceed and to select probable procurement method.

B: Strategic Briefing Preparation of Strategic Brief by, or on behalf of, the client confirming key requirements and constraints. Identification of procedures, organisational structure and range of consultants and others to be engaged for the project. [Identifies the strategic brief (as CIB Guide) which becomes the clear responsibility of the client]

C: Outline proposals. Commence development of strategic brief into full project brief. Preparation of outline proposals and estimate of cost. Review of procurement route.

D: Detailed proposals. Complete development of the project brief. Preparation of detailed proposals. Application for full development control approval.

E: Final proposals. Preparation of final proposals for the Project sufficient for co-ordination of all components and elements of the Project.

F: Production information F1: Preparation of production information in sufficient detail to enable a tender or tenders to be obtained. Application for statutory approvals. F2: Preparation of further production information required under the building contract. [Now in two parts, F1 - the production information sufficient to obtain tenders and F2 - the balance required under the building contract to complete the information for construction]

G: Tender documentation. Preparation and collation of tender documentation in sufficient detail to enable a tender or tenders to be obtained for the construction of the Project. [Solely concerned with the documentation required for tenders. Particularly useful with D+B or management contracts]

H: Tender action. Identification and evaluation of potential contractors and/or specialists for the construction of the project. Obtaining and appraising tenders and submission of recommendations to the client.

J: Mobilisation. Letting the building contract, appointing the contractor. Issuing of production information to the contractor. Arranging site handover to the contractor.

K: Construction to Practical Completion. Administration of the building contract up to and including practical completion. Provision to the contractor of further information as and when reasonably required.

L: After Practical completion. Administration of the building contract after practical completion. Making final inspections and settling the final account. [Clearly separated from the construction phase]

[seanie]

Now the initial stages of a project aren't so linear and there's a degree of back and forth, and the latter stages aren't always so clear cut as they should be. Design is an iterative process. You develop a proposal, consult on it, evaluate and amend it. And you have to repeat that process, in a myriad of ways, to develop a suitable design. Done properly it is a very time consuming process.

Formally this process hasn't even started yet. But to even get off the ground there will be rough costings, area calculations etc. to guide a decision. The process of design is a development from the vague to the particular and at this point in time some, perhaps many, aspects of any proposal will be speculative and subject to change.

So it comes down to what's understood by the phrase "the plans had already been drawn up for the new school".

If that is supposed to mean that a considerable amount of design development has taken place and that the form and location of the school had already been settled on then I'd say that's silly.

If it's taken to mean that some rough costings, an outline area assessment, and sombody's sketched a couple of indicative plans at 1/1000 then I'd say what do you expect them to do?

That's not evidence that the proposals are a done deal. It's evidence that the viability of the proposals are being tested.

[Dave Connelly]

[Dave Connelly]

[bathst2]

[Rex_Mundi]

[seanie]